Rick Santorum Calls For End Of Public Education, Says Parents Should Home School Their Kids

you think if i printed up a bunch i could sell them here?

man, i could make a mint on this, thanx robert. i'll figure out some kind of finders fee so to speak for you.

The RNC's got to be cringing right now hoping Santorum comes down with a bad case of laryngitis.

It's going to be a long two weeks for them. :)

rick santorum encouraging the dumbing down of america by getting rid of public education.

Michele Bachmann was home schooled and we see how well she turned out.

I have never, ever met a home-schooled child (with one exception, because she was excelling beyond her classmates and her family used the home-school curriculum provided by the state) who wasn't socially, emotionally or psychologically screwed up.

As a college professor, I see the struggles that homeschooled students have when entering a classroom environment. Please, keep your kids in public school. They come better prepared for a college education.

I have one student working for me who was home schooled. I cannot wait to see the back of him. His social skills are horrendous. If he wasn't a senior, I would have fired him earlier this year. But we felt sorry for him. It would have been impossible for him to get another job. I would never home school my child. By the way, how could I with all my degrees in history and law possibly teach my child high school chemistry and physics. I thank God for her high school teachers, many who are as educated as I am.

NICE

Considering that IQ has nothing to do with the learning environment and all to do with the ability to learn, your argument holds as much water as a sieve.

What needs to happen is the end of homeschooling. Then we would not have a bunch of students ill prepared to compete in the competitive world of higher academia and the real world. Instead, we have these kids coming into college with zero social skills and an inability to function in the classroom. They do not have the ability to work in teams, and do very little to contribute to the teams in which they are placed. Their whole knowledge base is biased by the lack of their parents' ability to fully grasp the wide variety of information that comprises an academic system.

Agreed, Dr. Truth.
I seriously question the motives of parents who insist on home schooling. Often the parents were dysfunctional in schools--in a variety of different ways--and therefore deny their children an appropriate education based on the difficulties the parents experienced.

It also says something about the over-inflated ego of many parents who think that they can provide an adequate education, to say nothing of providing their children with age-appropriate social interaction.

Let us just break it down logically.

Why are homeschooling parents then wasting their money by sending their little precious sweethearts to colleges or universities? They might as well buy the latest print shop software and keep the little darling at home for another four years. Maybe they can call it mommy university. Because let us look at the logic.

Mommy keeps junior home because she believes he will be smarter if she educates him than if she sends him to school where college educated and trained teachers are educating students. This must mean that mommy thinks she is smarter than the college educated teacher. But if she is so much smarter than the college educated teacher, then she must also be so much smarter than the college educated teacher's college professor. Because the information and teaching style of the teacher is passed down from the professor. Therefore, a PhD is inferior to mommy (who might or might not have a bachelor's degree). Mommy knows everything. Well, mommy, on my worst day I have more academic knowledge that you do on your best day. And mommy, I am trained to keep up with the latest trends on my particular area of expertise. Have you kept up as well as I?

I'd have gotten a teaching certificate in biology and perhaps math myself, except that our teachers are paid so well that they never leave so there aren't a lot of openings

Great excuse, but those two disciplines are (and have been) among those with the highest demand for teachers across the nation. Possibly it was really a matter of not having any courses in education which are required for a teaching license/certificate.

Michele Bachmann was home schooled and we see how well she turned out.

I used to work with a girl who was homeschooled. This is anecdotal, but from all the people I've met and places I've lived there were only two who were homeschooled. One was a Jehovah Witness (nuff said), the other was my coworker.

She knew pretty much nothing about anything. Seriously, it was AMAZING how little she knew.

I need not bother going into her undeveloped and unchallenged views on evolution and young earth creationism. She is 29 years old and has children of her own now.

Just a few things: She never heard of Star Wars. She didn't know who Elmo was. She never heard of Indiana Jones. She thought that WWI and WWII were both against Hitler. She thought Sabretooth Tigers and Woolly Mammoth were fictional. She thought Hindu and Muslim were the same. She never heard of Stephen King, Dickens, Poe, or pretty much any book other than the Bible or Christian literature. She didn't believe that an infection could be life threatening. She didn't know who Bill Gates was. She didn't know what caused the tides, why the sky was blue, what caused rainbows... attributed them all to God... and still thinks them 'unanswerable miracles' even though I have explained the science to her.

Yes, homeschooling... it's great. /s/

Okay, Dr. Truth, let's hear some more of the left wing tolerance. Why does your university take homeschooled kids in the first place if they are so ill prepared? Why do even Ivy League colleges like Harvard welcome them? Please live up to your screen name for a change. You teach a class in human sexuality, so how the heck could ANY of your 18 year old students possibly be ill prepared for THAT?

most colleges, admittance is based on ACT/SAT scores, so if you can test well, you'll get in fine, but after that, if you lack critical thinking, and the abilty to learn. youll crash and burn

there is a reason that the dropout rate at colleges is as high as it is

And thus she's eminently qualified to homeschool her own children to the same high standards, according to OomYaaqb.

Homeschoolers have a wide variety of reasons for their choice but in polls the number one reason is simple: "the school wasn't meeting my child(ren)'s educational needs."

Yeah, and usually those 'educational needs' according to the parents is 'more indoctrination' and 'less science'. Needs indeed.

Few of those who are pulled out of public schools when public isn't meeting a child's needs are sent to private advanced schools, but most of the time it's for cases like above.

The child comes home and talks about dinosaurs, evolution, or other religions - while maybe talking about a few of the more social things he learned - and the child's needs are 'not being met' properly by the school.

D Luniz is absolutely correct. Colleges and Universities accept students based on ACT/SAT scores. If you have a child that can score a 18 on the ACT or an 1100 on the SAT, most public colleges and universities will accept them. Our requirements are a lot more stringent, but most homeschoolers who attend here spend at least one year at a community college before transferring into our university. So, they use the scores at a community college to propel them into our environment.

Shuklack, Imagine trying to educate her if she attempted to enter higher education. Your coworker is not the exception, but the rule. I get to teach these bubble children. I typically encounter one of two a year, and they come to college with all the misinformation their mommies have pumped into their brains. Mommy thinks junior is brilliant and understands Marx and Nietzsche, but the fact is that mommy doesn't understand them herself. Therefore, all of what junior knows about them is what little mommy knows. Then they come into my classical sociology classes and spout everything that mommy taught them. I can tell stories of homeschooled students that had temper tantrums in class because they would rather believe what mommy said than the reality.

The reality is that these homeschooled children are put at an academic disadvantage because of overprotective and sheltering parents who would rather shield their children from reality than give them a proper education. These children are put at a social disadvantage because mommy doesn't have the skills, or desire, to ween them off the teat. The fact is that if you look at the majority of homeschooled kids, they are wasting away, languishing at home, being indoctrinated by mommy's paranoia and misconceptions. They are the ones that must suffer because of mommy's poor choice. I pity the child.

While I virtually never agree with Oom

Do us all a favor and crawl back into whatever third-world toilet of a country overflowed and let you out!

THAT was a clear CoH violation, and have reported it as such.

I generally don't believe that home schooling produces a well rounded student, and I have very little exposure to them, for I don't believe a child not knowing who Elmo or Star Wars is severely deficient. Children who know who Elmo is usually have spent a number of hours in front of a T.V.

I only know one family that home schools, and their children are brilliant. Have wonderful social skills and can engage an adult in intelligent conversation by the 5th grade. The mother used to be a teacher, and took time off for their education. Father is an engineer and is also fully involve. The kids do things and have experiences that virtually no child in public education gets. Their's may be unique, or perhaps it's our location which's in a large metropolitan area, with most people in our local area with advanced degrees.

As I say, I almost never agree with Oom, but there are several comments on here that go over board. We are supposed to respect posters even though we don't respect their posts.

As well, you all I know that I think Rick Santorum is beyond the pale, and along with others, hope he wins the nomination.

Have you reported every CoH violation here? Are you sure?

The scenario you are describing is an EDUCATOR homeschooling. An EDUCATOR with a DEGREE in EDUCATION teaching their child. That is a completely different ballgame.

Of course, now we are going to just have to wait until the next round of fairy tales and then you can judge us again for not tolerating the lies. Your victim is not innocent, but a victim of their own making.

I don't believe a child not knowing who Elmo or Star Wars is severely deficient

Maybe not deficient, but sheltered, and thus at a major disadvantage in real world social settings where the capability to relate to others is of the utmost importance.

You also seemed to miss the rest... like thinking WWI and II were both against Hitler, oh and I forgot to mention that she believes fossils are just 'random formations in the sand'....

Not knowing Star Wars / Elmo, two major icons of American pop-culture to which it would take a willfull effort by the parents to avoid exposure, is only indicative of a deeper problem.

It may not seem like a big deal, but to be ignorant of things so visible to most of the population, it makes one wonder if she doesn't know THAT what else does she not know? If a person is ignorant of Star Wars or Elmo, just imagine of what else that person is ignorant.

Dr Truth,

Are you yelling at me? This isn't my seed, and I'm not the one to monitor it. Actually, yes, I also reported the one where Oom made a remark about you. There also is some unnecessary gang collapsing going on which shouldn't happen just because one doesn't agree with the post unless it's inflammatory., but as I said, this isn't my seed.

No, I am not yelling at you, but rather emphasizing words. Your example is an educator that took time to educate their child. That is a completely different ballgame. When a college buddy of mine had a daughter diagnosed with cancer, she was unable to attend school during the surgery and treatment. My friend was a college professor who taught in the education field. She took a year off to educate and care for her daughter. When the doctor's recommended the child not return to school for another year, her husband (also an education professor) took the next year off to teach the daughter. When the doctor's gave the go ahead, the child returned to public school without missing an academic beat. They were able to provide her an excellent education for those two years because they were trained educators. They were not just bored housewives or religious zealots who thought they knew more than the teachers, they were actual teachers. However, both parents will acknowledge that while they were able to scholastically maintain their child's progress, they were unable to provide her with the environment of a school and she missed out on social and developmental milestones. It is these social and developmental milestones that are essential in the formation of a complete adult. Fortunately, returning to public education she was able to make up these experiences to a point. The child protected in a bubble by a non-trained parent will never make up these milestones. They will enter the world deficient and unable to recreate these important landmarks.

I made it clear that it was the only family I knew. Having said that, I live in a large area and they do come together (albeit) with other kids that are home schooled for large track meets, football games, swim meets, etc. I can't think that this particular family would "hang around" with a lot of uneducated kids. This group may also be unique that they take some computer based classes. You see that I'm adding qualifiers to each of my posts.

Shuklack

Michele Bachmann was home schooled and we see how well she turned out.

I used to work with a girl who was homeschooled. This is anecdotal, but from all the people I've met and places I've lived there were only two who were homeschooled. One was a Jehovah Witness (nuff said), the other was my coworker.

She knew pretty much nothing about anything. Seriously, it was AMAZING how little she knew.

I need not bother going into her undeveloped and unchallenged views on evolution and young earth creationism. She is 29 years old and has children of her own now.

Just a few things: She never heard of Star Wars. She didn't know who Elmo was. She never heard of Indiana Jones. She thought that WWI and WWII were both against Hitler. She thought Sabretooth Tigers and Woolly Mammoth were fictional. She thought Hindu and Muslim were the same. She never heard of Stephen King, Dickens, Poe, or pretty much any book other than the Bible or Christian literature. She didn't believe that an infection could be life threatening. She didn't know who Bill Gates was. She didn't know what caused the tides, why the sky was blue, what caused rainbows... attributed them all to God... and still thinks them 'unanswerable miracles' even though I have explained the science to her.

Yes, homeschooling... it's great. /s/

I also knew a girl like that when I went to college. Actually, she was brilliant and uber-smart and aced every course. She came from an ultra-zealous, ultra-conservative Catholic family that "sheltered" its children from all "evil" influences. Their children were allowed little to virtually no "outside" contact, including with friends. (They might end up watching TV, which was verboten, at a friend's house.) They could only play with their siblings, and even play was greatly restricted within those limits. While all the kids were made to dress ultra-conservatively (the sons had to wear long-sleeved shirts at all times, buttoned to the neck and down to the wrists, and black slacks with white socks along with dark shoes), the daughters were especially made to always appear "modestly." They were never allowed to cut their hair, wear make-up, or dress in anything beyond wrist-to-neck blouses (also all buttoned up, no matter if it was summer and 100 degrees) and long, woolen jumper dresses that went almost to their ankles. These parents homeschooled their kids, and the parents were able to only teach the very basics in things such as history and literature, using old Catholic text books from the 1940's and '50's they found at old book stores. As for things like math and "science," they hired tutors (and the science tutors were told to keep such heretical stuff like evolution out of the curriculum).

Anyway, this girl attended the same small college I did. Like I said, she did very well and even graduated summa cum laude, which shows she had the technical skills and talent to be brilliant. However, socially, the poor thing was a disaster. She had no idea about the world around her. Nothing. She could not carry on a conversation (and we all tried to include her and bring her out) and would become so stressed out in these social interactions, whether in the classroom, the library, the cafeteria or the student lounge, she would become ill. She looked just like the main character from Stephen King's Carrie. Upon graduation in our small college, she had no marketable skills (despite her summa position and a degree in library science - and some of the classes regarding books from, to her, and unknown author named Judy Blume shocked her reserved brainwashing). So she entered a convent to become a teaching nun but the last thing I or any of us heard was that she was "expelled" because of her complete lack of socialability among the other nuns (and it was a conservative order). That was the last I heard of her and who knows where she is now, the poor, wretched girl. We did hear that eventually most of her siblings who were raised the same way as her did rebel against their parents and while some were able to repair their damaged lives (one went on to establish and run a very successful motel/resort), others made choices that weren't so grand. I discovered, a few years ago, that, after both parents ended up disowning their kids for "falling away from the faith," the parents eventually divorced when the wife could no longer take the physical abuse she received at the hands of her husband - and the husband ended up serving time in prison for refusing to pay income taxes because he said it was "communist." The mother reconciled with some of her children (and she has gone so far now as to have her hair done at a salon, uses make-up and even wears short dresses and skirts and even - oh, the horrors! - slacks). She went back to school, got a degree in accounting, and works for a tax consultant firm. But as to what happened to my former college classmate, I don't know. Rumor has it she ended up pregnant and living in a ramshackled house with her boyfriend with both on welfare, but that's only rumor.

Homeschooling, yeah. Now, there'll be those who say this was a misnomer, but like I said, except for one, all the kids I know who were homeschooled ended up as social miscreants as adults. Everything I've offered has only been argument by example, but it's the same one they use.

Just a few things: She never heard of Star Wars. She didn't know who Elmo was. She never heard of Indiana Jones. She thought that WWI and WWII were both against Hitler. She thought Sabretooth Tigers and Woolly Mammoth were fictional. She thought Hindu and Muslim were the same. She never heard of Stephen King, Dickens, Poe, or pretty much any book other than the Bible or Christian literature. She didn't believe that an infection could be life threatening. She didn't know who Bill Gates was. She didn't know what caused the tides, why the sky was blue, what caused rainbows... attributed them all to God... and still thinks them 'unanswerable miracles' even though I have explained the science to her.

Oh my gosh. You are kidding, right?

Homeschoolers have a wide variety of reasons for their choice but in polls the number one reason is simple: "the school wasn't meeting my child(ren)'s educational needs."

Yeah, and usually those 'educational needs' according to the parents is 'more indoctrination' and 'less science'. Needs indeed.

I did take mine out of school because it was not meeting their academic needs. Can you imagine a pair of seventh graders that can't even read at the second grade level? Couldn't do math beyond the basic add & subtract, science was a complete mystery and seem beyond too complicated to them. It was horrible, the school had quite literally and with great effectiveness taught them they were unteachable. They couldn't even write, and what little they could was all phonetic.

These same kids read several newspapers daily. They are well informed in current events and politics locally, nationally and on the world stage. Could tell you more about American and world history than you'd ever want to know. Have read and can discuss most of the great American classics. As far as science, I taught them REAL sciences, not that creation garbage. We spent a lot of time in Science and Natural History museums to add to the text books.

One of my kids attended an Ivy League university and achieved a 4.25 GPA. (he took on all sorts of extra activities because they excited him) He is a published author, has written peer reviewed articles for major science publications, etc. Another is an IT nut and can solve what even Microsoft considers the unsolvable. Another has a passion for culinary arts.

You CAN home school and produce intelligent, accomplished adults. I'm always floored to hear stories of the home schooled who are completely vacuous between the ears and socially inept.

Something smells very fishy about your whole story, and here is why...

Where were you from first grade to seventh that YOU would allow your children to be illiterate? It seems you were falling asleep on the job, mom. Did you ever bother to check their homework, or see them read? Did you not encourage them to read on their own. So now it is some imaginary school that failed them and you are not at all to blame /s/.

Yet, within 5 years, you alone were able to turn around an illiterate and uneducated person to attend an Ivy League school. Wow. Exactly how did you do that, and why weren't you that involved in the first seven years?

By the way, you should always be wary of the claims you make. Thanks to the accrediting process for colleges and the equilibrium of grading standards enacted in the 80s by the HLC, a college or university student is incapable of graduating with above a 4.0 GPA. While students at a high school level can receive above a 4.0 (especially in AP classes), colleges and universities do not have this luxury. Now, there are 8 Ivy League schools in the US. We know that Harvard, Yale, Dartmouth, Princeton, and Penn have a 4.0 scale listed for classes and graduation. Brown abolished GPAs in 1969, so that rules it out. Cornell has certain classes that can grade up to 4.3, but it is mathematically impossible for a student to take enough of these classes within the 124 credit hours necessary for a Bachelor's to graduate with a 4.25. Finally, Columbia has a 4.33 GPA as highest GPA for certain courses; yet, it is impossible for a student to attain a 4.25 with the requisite classes necessary for a bachelor's degree. Even if a student has classes marked with a GPA above 4.0 (which is highly unlikely), the university still only recognizes the 4.0.

Now, the problem is that when you make that statement, it totally eliminates the validity of any claims you make about your children. Sorry, but it pays to be truthful at all times.

It was the particular school system they attended. The teachers kept insisting they were learning, and put the kids through evaluation after evaluation. Explaining to me that they (the older ones) suffered from short term memory problems and other things. It was frustrating, for both them and for me watching it. When the youngest came into the system they simply pigeon holed her as well. They actually had that kid convinced she could not read unless she had a blue sheet of plastic over the sheet of paper because she had blue eyes. (seriously the crap was getting beyond ridiculous)

As a parent, you trust and believe what these so called "experts" have to say. Then do your best to support that, which I did.

When I first started teaching them it took a while to find what "clicked". What would work to make learning possible. It took time and effort on my part. Once I found the "key" they just took off flying and were able to absorb the material.

As far as the Ivy League, it was NOT a U.S. university. Not fair to lecture others on making assumptions while you do the same.

The youngest one I home schooled went back to public school (different town) for grades 10-12 and easily maintained straight A's.

By the way, the concept of Ivy League is an American invention. There are no Ivy League universities or colleges in any country other than America. I know that because I attended one of the most prestigious universities in the world one year. It was in England, and it was NEVER called an Ivy League University. Try again.

Honestly, I think the Amish have more fun than Santorum....

You guys ^^^ your #3 and #3.1 are hilarious! Stomach-hurting funny.

Guess what, most online or cyberschools ARE public schools. About half the states now have them. They are free, available to every child in the state who meets their criteria in terms of age, etc., and must follow the same laws as brick and mortar public schools. It's a good deal for parents as they assign each student a certified teacher, and in addition they loan free books, materials, a computer, and even your Internet connection. There are regular educational field trips and other fun get togethers. If your child is old enough to be alone for a few hours, you could probably manage to work part time and still do this. (Some parental involvement during normal business hours IS usually required because you as well as the child must be in regular phone contact with the teacher.) Or, again, a spouse who works evening or night shift comes in very handy in this case. They don't work for everybody, and they weren't ideal for my kids, but they are still another option that work for many.

Just think of the amounts of money that could be saved by doing away with brick and mortar schools....No more construction of schools...And in the cost of upkeep, energy furnishing.and the cost of school buses fuel and maintenance to get children to a central location...

Hell you could even keep a very large percentage of teachers... The costs saved for teachers not having to commute to and from school the saved time in their days...could allow a slightly lower wage and still a savings to the individual teachers...

It really would be fun to gut the Dept of Education and decentralize education ... Save money and improve the education of millions of kids nation wide!

OomYaaqub

Guess what, most online or cyberschools ARE public schools. About half the states now have them.

It's true that the cyberschools are public schools. It's also true that the homeschooled are not physically exposed to their classmates via cyberschool. In homeschooling parents' minds, their children are not exposed to what they may consider as the base natures of culture and ideas. Homeschooling parents get to have total control over exchange of ideas and culture experienced by their children. When their children attend university, the university tends to be [not in absolutely every instance] a university selected for its Christian/religious based curriculum which further extends the parents' ideas/cultural teaching.

As far as homeschooling content is concerned, are any of you familiar with the "Great Courses" lectures? One is able to buy basic/introductory classroom information that aids homeschooling. At first, I thought that the content was mainly for adults who want university review inexpensively. I have since come to see the value of Great Courses as homeschooled content. Being homeschooled does not necessarily mean that the students are getting substandard education as there is freely available good content on the Internet often presented by homeschool associations. Have you ever paid attention to the books table at Cosco? A great deal of the materials are presented for homeschoolers. Bear in mind that the key thing about homeschooling is that parents control the cultural messages.

OomYaaqub

Guess what, most online or cyberschools ARE public schools. About half the states now have them. They are free, available to every child in the state who meets their criteria in terms of age, etc., and must follow the same laws as brick and mortar public schools. It's a good deal for parents as they assign each student a certified teacher, and in addition they loan free books, materials, a computer, and even your Internet connection. There are regular educational field trips and other fun get togethers. If your child is old enough to be alone for a few hours, you could probably manage to work part time and still do this. (Some parental involvement during normal business hours IS usually required because you as well as the child must be in regular phone contact with the teacher.) Or, again, a spouse who works evening or night shift comes in very handy in this case. They don't work for everybody, and they weren't ideal for my kids, but they are still another option that work for many.

Yup, you're absolutely correct about that type of homseschooling and, don't forget, it's from public schools. That's because public schools do it better. I've never seen a private school accomplish what a public school does. Public schools try to educate everyone and have to take everyone. They have to take kids with various cognitive, learning and emotional/behavior disabilities. Private schools don't have to take kids that come to school dirty, tired and hungry with parents who were out boozing and carousing the night before and have to deal with that. They can take the cremed' la creme and turn everyone else away. No private school, or some on-line homeschooling site filled with anti-intellectual garbage like creationism, can even approach the abilities of public schools.

Like I said, show me a homeschooled kid, and I'll show you a social miscreant anyday. They'll be just as screwed up as their parents.

Easy Dennis. As long as Citizen's United allows unlimited money to be given to freaks.

Good point.

Most parents are not qualified or unable to homeschool their children because they are working trying to feed and clothe them. If public schools got no support from fed or state govt, who will pay for it? Well, our property taxes, right? If I go low in an estimate say $10,000 per child, it will cost $30,000 to educate your 3 children in this example (and out of your own pocket!). That will go over really great, wont it? At least the GOP will get what it wants- a totally uneducated public, gullible and easy to control! This guy is totally out of his mind! He is really saying what the GOP desires, that's why they are not putting a muzzle on him!

There are parents out there who have no business home schooling their kids. I once considered it, but I'm not qualified enough in math and science to do even an adequate job and I love math and science. Not only that but I have to work full time. The only reason I considered home schooling was to get my kids out of an environment where I felt intolerance for anything different than white and Evangelical Christian.

However, very glad I didn't. My daughter was able to over come a lot of that @!$%# thrown at her and is now doing very well in her second semester of college.

and developing new points of view.

wouldn't that idea kind of describe progressive? so, that's why he wants to get public education.

Michele Bachmann was home schooled and we see how well she turned out.

Let's see, a tax attorney and Congresswoman, and wealthy. Obviously a complete failure. /sarcasm

Before you know it, they'll be thinking for themselves, challenging the status quo, and developing new points of view.

I went to public school for 13 years and was considered a very good student, but that's mainly because I knew enough to keep my real opinions to myself. Very few of my teachers wanted to hear any opinions other than their own, which they wanted parroted back to them. My kids at home were strongly encouraged to think for themselves, as evidenced by the fact that I have a 15 year old Marxist who attended the Occupy Pittsburgh rally and as well as a 21 year old nihilist wannabe. I'm not worried because I assume they'll grow out of it. I did ask them to write essays defending their positions. Neither will ever be a professional writer as their talents lie elsewhere, but they do know how to think logically and defend their opinions.

Let's see, a tax attorney and Congresswoman, and wealthy.

Well, let's see. She became a tax attorney because her husband told her to, and she attended a Christian college where the emphasis was on biblical studies. And she became a congressmember before most people realized how tryly nutty she is. I don't really see that happening again after her aborted (pun intended) presidential campaign.

Bachmann seems really sane compared to Santorum! (OOH that hurt to say that!)

He earned over $900,000 last year, so how crazy can he be? What he lacks, sadly, is the abiilty to communicate clearly. Most people can't listen to him for more than a few minutes without being completely befuddled--just what is he actually saying? He continually confuses his personal values (which nobody really cares about) with what he would actually do as Presient.

I don't know; I think he's been pretty up-front about what he wants to do. And yes, people care about his personal values because he's always been clear that they are what he wants to implement.

And based on your posting history you agree with him 100%.

He earned over $900,000 last year, so how crazy can he be?

I'll bet Pat Robertson made more than that, and he's even crazier than Santorum.

I guess the moral of the story is you can be as insanely unstable as you want, so long as you maintain a proper money to crazy ratio.

Shuklack,

It is common knowledge that at certain income level, you are no longer considered crazy...

you are eccentric

:o)

NO HIS V P

these geeks will still get beat up daily in home school....

By whom, B dune, the guinea pig? And BTW "geek" is not an insult. Real geeks (who are free to become self-taught computer whizzes from a young age since they aren't locked up in a school building all day) generally do very well in life.

Geeks like the college dropout failures... Proof that without a college degree your nothing...

Bill Gates

Steve Jobs

Mark Zuckerburg

Just think what they might have been had they just stayed in school ! (grins)

Yep, three out of the millions who will enter the job market. Those odds are worse than for the foolhardy kids who think they'll make a living as professional athletes.
For those who believe they are so smart, I strongly recommend they forego college. That will allow professors to spend more time and energy on those students who actually want to learn....

Oompah

You can take the smartest people in the world - but you still need to have the capability to interact - still need a way to get your ideas across...

No one will honestly say (of course you and some of your posse will challenge this) that the lack of "social interaction" by home schoolers is a good thing.

Eventually even the hs will need to move on to college, move on to the workplace - even if it were proved that hsers are far superior in the smarts department - smarts merely "opens the door"....one still must be able to interact with those from all walks of life to be successful.

Yes, I said "geeks"...you are the one who interpreted as "smarts"...I interpret "geek" as "socially".

btw - who will pound their azzes if they are home schooled - most children hs are not single children....there is always a pecking order - even within the "social network" of an individual house - now the "geek" with the least effective social skills will get pounded at home 16 hrs a day instead of 8.

How many millionaires have been created by Microsoft, Apple and Face book? Lets up the number from 3 ...OH wait that would kind of be trickle down ... Damn Damn Damn...

Hey Happy how many college grads are sitting around (OWS) bitchin about their college loans and unemployed? A college degree is not the answer its a tool to help find the answer.

A generation of youth has been told they have to get loans and go to college ... A large percent of which are not even working in the field they have degrees in or working in jobs that even require a degree ... BUT THEY HAVE A STUDENT LOAN !

You might as well take out loans to burn money for heat this winter ... If you get a degree in one of the hundreds of degree programs offered of which there are NO JOBS ! College officails should be lined up for jail taking kids money for by selling them dreams they know will never come true...

You know what the top two degrees awarded in the US are...?

Business Administration

Liberal Arts

Yea over a half a million degrees between the 2 ... Oh Yea money well spent...

here is a listing of the top 300 degrees awarded..

http://www.matchcollege.com/top-majors

Now go to the other end .... Degrees that might really lead to jobs ... Engineering fields and technical fields ...

#300 Biotechnology 1,642.... # 292 Computer Engineering Technology Degree 1,755...#288 Science Teacher Education Degree 1,807

Jim44

Hey Happy how many college grads are sitting around (OWS) bitchin about their college loans and unemployed? A college degree is not the answer its a tool to help find the answer.

What does this comment have to do with dismantling public education?

What does this comment have to do with dismantling public education?

Nothing whatsoever. Jim just likes to rant.

Geeks like the college dropout failures... Proof that without a college degree your nothing...

Bill Gates

Steve Jobs

Mark Zuckerburg

Just think what they might have been had they just stayed in school ! (grins)

BUT, they went, and that exposure allowed them to create GLOBAL empires. Mark co-created facebook while at school with some other classmates. He can also read, speak, and write 4 different languages, languages he learned in school.....

Steve Jobs was there for like 6 months ...LOL

Jim44 wrote:

How many millionaires have been created by Microsoft, Apple and Face book?

Not to perpetuate your silly anti-intellectualist argument, but go apply for a position at any of those companies without a degree and see how far you get.

Not to split hairs here, but the discussion is about public education...not college education.

To draw further on your examples:

Steve Jobs:

attended Monta Loma Elementary, Mountain View, Cupertino Junior High and Homestead High School in Cupertino, California. All public schools

Bill Gates:

attended the Lakeside school, an exclusive private preparatory school

Mark Zuckerberg:

attended public schools most of his life, including Ardsley High School, but transferred and graduated from Phillips Exeter Academy during his junior year.

so there you have it, one publically educated, one privately educated, one who had both...

none of them home schooled.

Sincerely,

ol doc gold, PHD (Public High school Diploma)

It is also forgotten that Gates learned his trade by building calculators. As his earliest foray into computers were just oversized calculators, it would be easy to see how it wasn't a lack of education but a presence of education that contributed to his success. That success was continued not because of his skill, but by hiring college educated employees. The same can be said of Steve Jobs. He did not rise to the mountaintop without hiring college educated employees that built the company to what it is today.

Da Saint's followers don't need to listen to him. They don't need to understand what he is saying, they don't need to hear him.

He's not black and that's all that matters.

If these idiots ever listened and understood what this disgusting, evil, hateful, petty little man was really saying they'd run for the nearest prayer meeting. Besides, most of his followers can't read any word over four letters long, so how in the hell are they going to edumacate their kids.

IMHO, Da Saint is becoming desperately tedious as he becomes more and more desperate. He's not even funny anymore, just desperately disgusting.

and people call Ron Paul crazy because he wants to end the war...

No, people call Ron Paul crazy because of some of his other ideas.

Jennifer-2446215 wrote:

I have to wonder why this guy is leading in the polls.

He's not Romney, and he's the only one left in the clown car, save for Paul, who hasn't had a turn as the top punchbowl floater.

Not too many think it would be crazy to end the war. To say you will never ever no matter what enter into another war in a foreign country is kinda crazy.

Bill

He is pretty creepy just standing there and speaking about his views of the world and how he would run the country. Whatever is in the closet has to be scary.

OK- so lets go with this batsh#t crazy, ultra orthodox Catholic, Dan Quayle. He somehow becomes president ( Diebold?). Israel bombs Iran's nuclear facilities. He needs to make a decision about getting involved. He only thinks about the Crusades and (with all of his humongous military experience), he could play the part of Richard the Lion Hearted. What an opportunity for Rickeroo to come to the rescue of the world and the Catholic Church!

Actually the Israeli's and the Iranians might just bomb us if they put this loon in office.

NICE

This guy has skeletons and they need to be found!

In 2006 he was known to be one of the most corrupted senators you have to be pretty bad to get that status..

Here is a video that may help clear it up

http://youtu.be/LdaEe-pNn6M

He has skeletons, but they aren't in the closet. They are well known to Pennsylvanians. Most are petty enough compared to, say, Watergate, but there's a kind of clumsy cluelessness about them. Too bad, because I actually like the guy, or would if he could keep his foot out of his mouth.

Santorum and his skeletons need to go back into the closet, shut the door and lock it. We live the the 21st century and this man is plain wacked out. Even if one thought that the world was really ending in November, this guy is not the one to follow to eternity with.

What would a country have to gane from an uneducated population

What does gane mean? hmmmmmmm

i hit spell check and it said it was good sorry

If you need spell check to spell gain, there's a problem.

You're confusing "education" with "school". Our greatest genius, Ben Frankling, spent a total of nine MONTHS being formally schooled. Edison had even less.

Ben Frankling, spent a total of nine MONTHS being formally schooled. Edison had even less.

Ahhhhh....another person who, along with Sanctimonious, wants to turn education back to the 18th. and 19th. centuries. Now there's a great suggestion for 21st. century competition. /s/

Well lets see the Democrats, the Unions and the Progressives have controlled the education system in this country for decades... And its gotten us what?

U.S. Falls In World Education Rankings, Rated 'Average'

The three-yearly OECD Programme for International Student Assessment (PISA) report, which compares the knowledge and skills of 15-year-olds in 70 countries around the world, ranked the United States 14th out of 34 OECD countries for reading skills, 17th for science and a below-average 25th for mathematics.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/07/us-falls-in-world-education-rankings_n_793185.html

Democrat and Union and Educators solution ? SPEND EVEN MORE MONEY on the failed system... How dare people say enough is enough... Lets try something different...

They Spend WHAT? The Real Cost of Public Schools

http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=11432

If you need spell check to spell gain, there's a problem.

Hey, I use spellcheck, myself. Problem is, while I can spell fine, I can't type for $hit. And for what it's worth I sometimes find spellcheck flagging correctly spelled words.

Democrat and Union and Educators solution ? SPEND EVEN MORE MONEY on the failed system... How dare people say enough is enough... Lets try something different...

Yeah, let's allow everybody to get all the education they can personally afford. Great way to keep up with the educational systems in the rest of the world (except, maybe Somalia.) Yup, we'll easily be able to compete in the global economy.

Not!

Yup, we'll easily be able to compete in the global economy.

And we are now? You bother to even look at the link provided ...Probably not... But feel free to comment about how poorly we are doing against the rest of the world .....hahahahha

And how said anything about "personally" paying for a childs education...Well except YOU? Per the progressive tactic... go all the way to the other end of the spectrum... cut back on a food program = Starve people to death..

Ben Frankling, spent a total of nine MONTHS being formally schooled. Edison had even less.

I have never heard of Ben Frankling, but Ben Franklin did not have to face the technology of today. Edison did not have to face the technology of today. If you want to give your children only the level of knowledge these two men had at their time of life, be prepared to also teach your children "Do you want fries with that?"

OK, if you're homeschooling, who's going to be doing the actual schooling? And who pays for that? You either hire private tutors, or you do it yourself.

If you do it yourself that presupposes the idea that you aren't working at an outside job and bringing in income you likely need to provide for your family. And before you say "use free on-line schools" keep in mind that requires a computer and Internet access, which must also be paid for.

Textbooks and other course materials? They need to be purchased, too, you know.

It also assumes that you know enough about required educational topics to make a good choice in on-line schools.

And if you only have, for example, a 10 year old high school diploma how does that prepare you to teach the technical topics that colleges require for admission?

Like it or not, modern education is more than knowing basic reading, spelling, and arithmetic.

So I say yes, PERSONALLY PAY FOR.

Ben Frankling, spent a total of nine MONTHS being formally schooled. Edison had even less.

And how many people are as intelligent as they were? I know I'm not.

Well, God told Santorum, Bachmann and Perry to run for president, so I can only assume that God is a Democrat.

Then the family must starve. That's ok with Sick Rick-he likes income inequality and wants it to continue.

And considering Rick's position on contraception even the home schools are going to have overceowded classrooms.

Yeap, this guy is saving the democratic campaign some serious dollars...just keep him talking.

Ricky Santorum believes it, and he's the best and brightest the Republican party has to offer.

You really should listen to him sometime. It's very interesting.

The Republican party saved the best for last.

That Fantasy is called Public Education , and Liberals always were for it;

1816 January 6. (to Charles Yancey) "If a nation expects to be ignorant & free, in a state of civilisation, it expects what never was & never will be."[7]

1818 January 14. (to Joseph C. Cabell) "Now let us see what the present primary schools cost us, on the supposition that all the children of 10. 11. & 12. years old are, as they ought to be, at school: and, if they are not, so much the work is the system; for they will be untaught, and their ignorance & vices will, in future life cost us much dearer in their consequences, than it would have done, in their correction, by a good education."[9]

1818 January 14. (to Joseph C. Cabell) "A system of general instruction, which shall reach every description of our citizens from the richest to the poorest, as it was the earliest, so will it be the latest, of all the public concerns in which I shall permit myself to take an interest."[10]

1824 March 27. (to Edward Everett) "The qualifications for self-government in society are not innate. They are the result of habit and long training."

Jeff on public education

Promote, then, as an object of primary importance, institutions for the general diffusion of knowledge. In proportion as the structure of a government gives force to public opinion, it is essential that public opinion should be enlightened.

Washington on public education

Very good Ted!!! Brilliant really!!!